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As another Summer comes to an end, and the temperatures start to drop you want to think about how you ‘left’ your cabin on your last trip, or more accurately if you properly winterized in preparation for the Winter. Each Fall we receive numerous ‘panicked’ calls from owners that have forgotten to winterize their cabins that are worried about their pipes freezing. While this may not seems like a ‘big’ deal, it is! If you have any doubts, just ask your Insurance Agent what the consequences will be from a ‘water damage’ claim on your Insurance. While I am not a licensed Plumber, I am a licensed Real Estate Broker that for many years has managed quite a few Vacation Rentals on our Program. For the sake of convenience and ease of reference, I’m going to break this down into sections;
When Should You ‘Partially’ Winterize: Anyone that does not live in their residence “full time”, and those full time residents that leave for extended periods of time for vacations, etc. should ‘partially’ winterize as a precaution by turning off their water, even in the Summer months. It only takes a few minutes and if a leak/break occurs, the only amount of water that can potentially leak out will be what is actually in the lines at the time.
When Should You Completely Winterize: I advise my second home clients to start a ‘full’ Winterization on Labor Day Weekend, and don’t stop until after Memorial Weekend. While we don’t expect temperatures to drop low enough to freeze pipes this early into Fall, most of you will find that your ‘visits’ to the cabin will be few, if not at all before Thanksgiving. Many owners will leave after Labor Day with the ‘intention’ of returning before Winter sets in, only to find that ‘all of a sudden’ they are hearing that snow is falling at the cabin and they realize they failed to Winterize.
How To Winterize: While the ‘set up’ in each cabin can differ, the following is a simplified version of the procedure;
1) First determine if your Water Heater is propane or electric. If propane, go to the Water Heater and turn the settings dial to ‘vacation’. Older Water Heaters may not have a ‘vacation’ setting, if so turn the dial to ‘pilot’. If your Water Heater is electric, go to the main electrical service panel (typically on the exterior of the cabin) and find the ‘breakers’ marked Water Heater. Turn them off.
2) Go into the ‘sub area’ (underneath the cabin) and find the water supply line where it enters the foundation. This will ‘typically’ be a copper line coming out of the ground. The ‘shut off’ valve may be either a round handle not unlike the handle to your hose bib, or it can also be a ‘directional’ handle. If it is a directional handle, turn it until the handle is at a 90 degree angle to the incoming water line.
3) Once the water is turned off, find the lowest water faucet (preferably on the exterior) and open the faucet, and leave it open. If there is no exterior faucet, open whatever faucet is at the ‘lowest’ elevation point in the cabin.
4) Now, go back through the cabin and open every water faucet, shower/tub faucet, and flush every toilet. As an additional safety measure, make sure to partially open the shower head ‘diverter’ valve, if so equipped. You goal is to eliminate as much water from the system as possible.
5) Next, pour a ‘cap full’ of antifreeze into each and every drain in the cabin including shower drains, sink drains, and toilets. Please don’t use RV Antifreeze which is already diluted and will not protect your pipes!
6) Lastly, close the door to your Dishwasher (if applicable) and turn on the Dishwasher for just a few seconds. This will activate the solenoid in the Dishwasher allowing what little water is in the line serving the Dishwasher to drain and prevent the plastic solenoid from freezing and breaking.
Conclusion: Even though you (or a service provider) properly shut down and drained your cabin, it is virtually impossible to evacuate all of the water from the system. There will always be an amount of water still in the pipes. The amount of water depends on if the plumbing system was properly ‘sloped’ when it was installed. When we experience freezing conditions, the remaining water in the system can still freeze and result in broken pipes. If you or someone else has not been to your cabin recently, I have very strong words of caution. Do not turn on the water and leave the cabin without looking and listening for breaks!
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[...] or no warning. If you are unsure of the procedure to winterize your cabin please review this post http://blog.skibear.com/?p=402. October 5th, 2009 | Category: [...]
There is plenty of good advice here, but I do take issue with one item. The blog strongly recommended (all in BOLD) “Please don’t use RV Antifreeze which is already diluted and will not protect your pipes!”.
This is simply untrue, and what’s more, there are good reasons to specifically use the RV/Marine antifreeze rather than automobile antifreeze.
First of all, the RV antifreeze is formulated to protect to -50 degrees F. It will crystallize (i.e. get “slushy”) at about +10 degrees F, but will not expand and cause cracking or bursting until it reaches -50 (some formulas provide burst protection to -100, but unless you’re living above the Arctic Circle this is overkill). So if used properly, it will be more than adequate to protect plumbing over winter.
Secondly, and more importantly, automobile antifreeze is extremely toxic to humans and animals, and adding it to plumbing systems where it makes its way to septic systems, groundwater, etc. is not a good thing. The RV/Marine antifreeze is classified as non-toxic. It’s actually used in some cases as a food additive.
And finally, the RV/Marine antifreeze is generally much less expensive than automobile antifreeze. A gallon of RV (typically pink in color) can usually be found for $5 or less, while undiluted auto antifreeze usually approaches $10/gallon.
I’ve been winterizing my cabin’s plumbing in northern Michigan for over 30 years using RV antifreeze. Daytime highs in January often stay below 10 degrees F, and I’ve never had freeze-damage to my plumbing.
Thank you very much for your comments! While I respect your knowledge and experiences, I will still ‘stand firm’ on my observations regarding the RV Antifreeze. Our firm manages quite a few Vacation Rentals (over 30+ years) and we have experienced the results of using RV Antifreeze first hand. Our open/close crews have actually found large chunks of completely frozen RV Antifreeze in toilet bowls. Additionally, several Licensed Plumbers have commented that it would take an entire gallon of RV Antifreeze to properly winterize a cabin as opposed to a cap full of regular Antifreeze. Lastly, your comment regarding toxic Antifreeze is right on the mark. Our ‘Owners’ know to use the environmentally safe version which is actually ‘spelled out’ in there Contracts. In California there is a huge fine (either $5,000 or $10,000) for contaminating ground water with regular Antifreeze. Thank you again! Here’s wishing you and your family a wonderful Thanksgiving!
Good advice. I am in the process of documenting winter procedures for the use of a family cabin in the southern Sierra. I am curious if you can give more information about how much you mean by a “cap full” of antifreeze. Do you mean about a couple of tablespoons? We have always used quite a bit more than that. I can’t seem to find good information on how much to use except what I get word of mouth, which is usually based more on tradition than trial and error. Thanks for the advice. However, I am concerned about cutting back to your recommendation without more information.
David, Thank you for your comments. My reference to a ‘cap full’ of Antifreeze is the cap of the Antifreeze bottle. While I’m not sure what the ‘low’ temps typically are at the location of your cabin, we have been using this method for many years without any issues. If you feel the temps might be lower than we experience at the 4000 to 5000 foot level here, it can’t hurt to use a little more. Keep in mind that this is to protect the ‘traps’ under sinks, showers, and tubs plus the toilet tanks and bowls. This will not protect against water remaining in the closed system of your pipes.
I have a cabin up in Big Bear which we make pretty regular trips to however, there maybe a few weeks here and there we can’t get away. I’m also going to be renting the cabin on occasion. My question is, if I leave the water heater on and set the thermostats inside at 55 do I still need to turn the water off? I’m just trying to figure out the best way to manage this since I have a cleaning lady who comes in and will need the water on when after we or renters leave.. thanks
Greeper, Thank you for your comments! Over the years, quite a few of our clients (Vacation Rental Owners and weekend users) have wanted to do the same thing you are suggesting. Here is the dilemma with what you are proposing; leaving the heat on is still not a ‘guaranteed’ safeguard against your pipes freezing. While not a common occurrence, from time to time we do have power outages that can and have lasted several days. I’m assuming that this can and does happen in the Big Bear areas as well. If that happens, your heating system (even if natural gas or propane) will not function as the system requires electricity to run igniters and circulating fans which will leave your cabin at risk. The only exception to this rule is natural gas/propane woodstove styled units, which will continue to work without electricity. Even then, is it worth the risk if a thermo coupler or other component in the natural gas/propane delivery system fails and your cabin floods?
thanks for the reply, I basically decided it wasn’t worth the risk so we winterize each time we leave, I turn the stop/waste valve off and drain each facet then put anti freeze in each drain.. Since I’m doing this should I still keep the thermostat at 55? It doesn’t seem like I still need to, and should I adjust the water heater to Vacation setting? Thanks and sorry for all the questions.. I’m glad I found this site/blog pretty cool..
Greeper, questions are a good thing! I think you have made a very wise decision in winterizing each time. It is much better to be safe than sorry! In this day and age of rising utility costs, I would suggest turning off your heating system completely since you are now winterizing every time. With respect to the Water Heater, if it is electric go to your main electrical panel (or sub panel if so equipped), and find the ‘double’ breaker that services the Water Heater and turn the breaker to the off position. If the Water Heater is gas (natural or propane), go to the Water Heater and turn the control knob to ‘pilot’, or if the unit is newer turn it to ‘vacation’.
One last important note on the Water Heater, if the Water Heater is electric it is very important to make sure when returning to the cabin to NOT turn the breakers to the Water Heater on until you have made sure the water has been turned on first. When you ‘drain down’ the water system, the possibility exists that a small amount of water will siphon off the top of the Water Heater Tank exposing the upper heating element. If electricity is applied before the element is submerged, the element will immediately ‘fry’ and drop to the bottom of the tank. If this happens, it is not the end of the world, but unless you are knowledgeable enough to replace the element, you will be paying a plumber to do it.
Good information here! We want to winterize our lake cabin in northern Indiana. We have well water, not city. How do I winterize the pump, pressure tank, etc.?
David, sorry for the delay. I was in Los Angeles for a Leadership Conference for two days. Unfortunately, I have very little experience with wells and storage tanks as we have a County wide water system in our area. I contacted one of our local plumbers and posed your question. The Plumber indicated that he was uncomfortable giving you an answer due to his unfamiliarity with your climate, and the size and design of the storage tank. I might suggest you contact a licensed plumber in the area of your cabin and see what he/she suggests. Please let me know what you discover…
[...] system. If you have not yet winterized your cabin, you can find instructions by following this link. While this not a common occurrence, the last time (I believe January 2007) we experienced single [...]
[...] system. If you have not yet winterized your cabin, you can find instructions by following this link. While this not a common occurrence, the last time (I believe January 2007) we experienced single [...]
thanks for all the info, since we’ll have renters up every so often and we’ll be up there we’ve chosen to keep the water heater on, it’s a gas heater.. As for the heaters inside I’ve lowered them down to 50, this way when either ourselves or renters show up it’s not absolutely freezing inside the place.. thanks again for the great tips and info..
I waswondering what brand ofnon-toxic anti-freeze you suggest? Can I purchase this in Sonora? Do most hardware or automotive storescarry this?
Thanks for your help
Paul, Thank you for your comment/question. I have spent the last two days in our Snow Removal Equipment so my memory is a little ‘fuzzy… lol. If memory serves me, I believe the brand I see locally is Sierra ’something’. I’m sure there are other brand names I’m not including. Our local auto supply (Arnold Auto Supply) carries it so you should not experience any difficulties finding it in multiple locations in Sonora such as OHS, Ace, and all of the automotive stores.
We recently winterized our cabin for this year and we live 12 hours away. We actually use RV fluid (7 to 8 gallons) and pump all remaning water out of the lines. Anyway, we have a washer and dryer hook up but we currently don’t have a washer/dryer. We forgot to do anything with the washer line, should we have and will this create a huge problem if we have not used a washer there yet?
Sue, Thank you for your comment. As I’m sure you noted when reading the post, we will not use RV antifreeze for the reasons stated in the article. That being said, if you have properly winterized your cabin there should not be anything additional that needs to be done to the plumbing servicing the laundry area of the cabin. Once the water has been shut off to the entire cabin, and the ‘lines’ have been drained, and all ‘traps’ antifreezed you should be fine.
It’s so refreshing to find articles like the ones you post on your site. Very informative reading. I will keep you bookmarked. Thanks!
We have a cabin that is three stories with a bathroom and water heater and manabloc water system on the lower level. Should be remove each of the feeds from the manabloc and drain everything that way. We also have an outside faucet on the lowest level. We could leave an electric heater in the room with the manabloc and water heater to keep that insulated room just above freezing but I understand what you say about power going off, our water heater is propane and the water comes from a public system that we can shut off in the manabloc room and we also have a stop and waste outside.
Judy, Thank you for your question. While I have a very ‘basic’ understanding of the definition of a Manabloc System, I do not believe I have ever winterized a cabin with this system. As I understand it, the Manabloc System functions as a ‘master’ control for the water distribution in your cabin allowing you to selectively control water to different parts of the cabin, as well as add additional water lines with less difficulty/expense. I’m hesitant to advise anything additional as I also understand that the Manabloc System is primarily made of plastic, and there may be additional steps needed to properly protect this system. I would be grateful if you would revisit the blog with any additional information on winterizing this type of system versus a non Manabloc System.
I appreciate you sharing this blog post.Really thank you! Cool.